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Poster: Jerrob Hungar Date: May 2, 2008 2:02am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: {Ignore this post...non-sense] ..".I came upon an empty space...."(?)

AshesRising,

What constitutes 'sense' in this life? Is 'empty space' a tautology or even a logical tautology? Will rtw enlighten us on that aspect? Was Bobby an autistic savant who had fathomed the mysteries of theoretical particle physics and postulated the concept of Dark Energy 30 years before it was even a gleam in Stephen Hawking's eye? Do you have to take a test to get a poetic licence? How do you like your blue eyed boy now, mister life?

These and many other questions have been provoked by your post, you agent provocateur, you. Damn you to heaven!

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Poster: snore Date: May 2, 2008 2:29am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: {Ignore this post...non-sense] ..".I came upon an empty space...."(?)

I thought space was the final frontier.

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Poster: Jerrob Hungar Date: May 2, 2008 3:16am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: {Ignore this post...non-sense] ..".I came upon an empty space...."(?)

Thats true. But 'empty space' is the penultimate frontier.
http://www.edge.org/3rd_culture/krauss06/krauss06.2_index.html

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Poster: robthewordsmith Date: May 2, 2008 3:24am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: {Ignore this post...non-sense] ..".I came upon an empty space...."(?)

Alan Im glad to see you making regular appearances here once more. I hope that the health issues that have kept you from us are now fully resolved and behind you.

I guess that Byroniuss adept copying and pasting rather pre-empts anything I might have to say on the subject of space, empty or other wise, although I will say that 'empty space' a concept I have no trouble with. What is certainly more mind-stretching is trying to have even the vaguest of vague notions as to what it is that space itself expands, or perhaps stretches is more correct, into. Consider that time and space are bound unto the very fabric of the physical universe. As the universe expands from its Big Bang point of origin is more space created for it to expand into - or is there just the same 'amount' of space that there was in the beginning and it just gets streeetttcchhhedd? Is space infinitely elastic or will it one day reach its elastic limit and snap back? Does space have elastic potential energy? Is that tied up with dark energy and vaccum energy? What lies beyond in the regions that the wavefront of the expanding universe has yet to reach? Some say the universe is infinite and that there is no outside I believe thats dodging the question. I believe I'll have another cup of coffee.

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Poster: elbow1126 Date: May 2, 2008 3:57am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: {Ignore this post...non-sense] ..".I came upon an empty space...."(?)

I believe you have had enough coffee.

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Poster: byronious Date: May 2, 2008 10:07am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: {Ignore this post...non-sense] ..".I came upon an empty space...."(?)

I don't believe the Grateful Dead or anyone on this forum has any knowledge of the physics attempted to be discussed here. why can't an empty space just be an empty space?

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Poster: Jerrob Hungar Date: May 2, 2008 7:53am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: {Ignore this post...non-sense] ..".I came upon an empty space...."(?)

Hi Rob. Thanks. I'm fine now apart from the fact that I'm addicted to this space. When I'm not here, I miss the music and the ol' banter. Sad innit? How about you? Bearing up under the existential chaos, I trust. Boris The Mayor? That's what I call mind-stretching.
Apparently, Causal Dynamical Triangulation is flavour of the month in physicistical circles these days, according to the New Scientist. I prefer Cryptical Envelopment myself. My view of the universe was severely warped after seeing the end of Men In Black.
Astronomy joke: Why do astronomers hate cosmologists? Because astronomers do all the counting while cosmologists do all the thinking. Maybe you have to be a cosmologist to get that one. I hope you'll forgive as it's friday afternoon! May your weekend be jolly and not too cosmological.
ps just read oor willie's post and still chortling!

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Poster: elbow1126 Date: May 2, 2008 8:23am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: {Ignore this post...non-sense] ..".I came upon an empty space...."(?)

I seem to recall reading somewhere that after Hubble had determined that the universe was expanding and essentially proving Einstein wrong (Einstein's equation predicted expansion but apparently he had troubles dealing with this notion so he added a constant in to rectify this, the Hubbles hosted the Einsteins at the observatory and showed them the telescope that allowed Hubble to make his observations. Upon seeing the telescope apparently Mrs. Einstein quipped some thing to the effect of "you need all that to make your discoveries, Albert just writes formulas on the back of envelopes." To me that has always summed up the difference between astronomers and cosmologists.

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Poster: robthewordsmith Date: May 2, 2008 8:37am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: {Ignore this post...non-sense] ..".I came upon an empty space...."(?)

Wasn't it Einstein who said something along the lines of 'Logic will take you from A to B,but imagination will take you anywhere.' And where would cosmology be if it wasn't for Einstein imagining what it would be like to ride on a light beam?

Moses came riding up on a quasar indeed.

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Poster: elbow1126 Date: May 2, 2008 8:55am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: {Ignore this post...non-sense] ..".I came upon an empty space...."(?)

Interesting that you should bring up that song lyric in this thread, as Ashes is fond of pointing out that Bobby changed the original lyric from guitar to quasar. Perhaps Bobby is a closet cosmologist, trying to help us all comprehend the empty and not so empty spaces that we encounter and yet do not understand. Maybe not.

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Poster: SomeDarkHollow Date: May 2, 2008 9:20am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: {Ignore this post...non-sense] ..".I came upon an empty space...."(?)

Easy on the combination of Bobby and closets. Someone will inevitably say something like the only reason Bobby is still in his closet is that Richard Simmons has locked him in it until he gives Richard his shorts back. Someone. Not me, but someone.

As for space and all the concepts that are associtated with it, I say just watch a couple of episodes of Lost In Space, and all your questions will be answered. "Danger, Will Robinson" indeed.

Don't you love how I can elevate any conversation?

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Poster: robthewordsmith Date: May 2, 2008 9:35am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Never fear, Smith is here ...

Now why is that you're so attracted to closets, and to emergence from same? To say nothing of your fascination for inappropriately shorts-clad aging rock stars? Some might begin to wonder at your motivations. Not I, of course. I stopped wondering a while back.

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Poster: SomeDarkHollow Date: May 2, 2008 9:46am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Never fear, Smith is here ...

Well, based on your packages you keep sending me, I can see why.

This post was modified by SomeDarkHollow on 2008-05-02 16:46:00

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Poster: robthewordsmith Date: May 2, 2008 9:46am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Never fear, Smith is here ...

Right then - I'm off for a stiff one then I'm going to cook pasta. I do hope the limp spaghetti won't remind me of you...

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Poster: SomeDarkHollow Date: May 2, 2008 9:53am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Never fear, Smith is here ...

A stiff one? Let me guess, you'll be off to the Prince's Reach Around Pub (you know, the one where you can only get in through the back door) for a quick one.


OK, I think this has gone as far as it should.

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Poster: William Tell Date: May 2, 2008 9:57am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Never fear, Smith is here ...

Leave it to you two to conjure images of Mr. Smith running with hands in the air shrieking about limp noodles and the danger therein...

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Poster: SomeDarkHollow Date: May 2, 2008 10:09am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Never fear, Smith is here ...

Well, in Rob's version Smith's hands aren't up in the air.

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Poster: jglynn1.2 Date: May 2, 2008 2:38pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Never fear, Smith is here ...

Happy to see you guys are keeping it real, pretty soon you'll be arguing about whats better 69 or 79 . . .

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Poster: SomeDarkHollow Date: May 2, 2008 4:57pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: Never fear, Smith is here ...

If Rob was Canadian he'd obviously pick 79...you know, so they both can watch the hockey game.

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Poster: AshesRising Date: May 2, 2008 3:32am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: {Ignore this post...non-sense] ..".I came upon an empty space...."(?)

Jerrob Hungar: Thank You for your response ...or, more accurately, your questions -- rhetorical or knot. '

The term seems like an oxymoron to me, however I understand how your doors of perception lead towards its tautological hue as well. Another ripple in "still" water, I guess.

"Words can only carve the space /
We fill with expectation..." ["Jack O'Roses"]

Let me rise, let me fall, let me climb, let me crawl
but let me in,
--- AshesRising

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Poster: ducats Date: May 2, 2008 5:10am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: {Ignore this post...non-sense] ..".I came upon an empty space...."(?)

There is another universe in the space that most others think is my fingernail. I obviously stole that from Animal House.

Along the same vain a friend and I invented (while tripping obviously) match world - this was the entire life cycle of a universe that existed inside/during the flame of a match when struck - ending ofcourse when the flame went out.

sign sign everywhere a sign

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Poster: northstar dead Date: May 2, 2008 5:42am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: {Ignore this post...non-sense] ..".I came upon an empty space...."(?)

You just don't get this kind thought any where else.

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Poster: Jerrob Hungar Date: May 2, 2008 9:11am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: {Ignore this post...non-sense] ..".I came upon an empty space...."(?)

Hi Ashes. I'll see your oxymoron and raise you a pleonasm.
Reading Hunter's journal from 6.23.06 - notes on turning 65 http://www.hunterarchive.com/files/newjournal/56journal_2006.html#anchor26253509 and wondering what you were up to.
Sorry about all the questions. Don't ya love it when people answer a question with a question? You can blame ganges! After I read how he'd tried to empty his mind, thought I'd give it a go and all that stuff just crawled into my hand, honest.

An excerpt from:
Down The Road
Lyrics: Robert Hunter

From the corner of my eye I saw the sun explode
I didn't look directly 'cause it would have burned my soul
When the smoke and thunder cleared enough to look around
I heard a sweet guitar lick, an old familiar sound
I heard a laugh I recognised come rolling from the earth
Saw it rise into the skies like lightning giving birth
It sounded like Garcia but I couldn't see the face
Just the beard and the glass and a smile on empty space

http://www3.clearlight.com/~acsa/intro.htm

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Poster: AshesRising Date: May 2, 2008 5:13pm
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: {Ignore this post...non-sense] ..".I came upon an empty space...."(?)

Jerrob Hungar: I was hoping that someone would find the "Down the Road" reference... I glad it was you. Are you aware of the story behind the composition of that verse?

Thanks a lot for the journal link: "Who will walk it is a mystery, but it will be no chance alliance."

The empty space of my so-called "life" has been immensely enriched by meeting both you and ganges along the Way (cool insight by ganges earlier, hey?),
--- AshesRising

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Poster: Jerrob Hungar Date: May 3, 2008 4:31am
Forum: GratefulDead Subject: Re: {Ignore this post...non-sense] ..".I came upon an empty space...."(?)

Dear AshesRising,
It seems so long ago now, when I was sitting in my office at work, playing with this mysterious new resource called the Internet and I remember feeling like a child with a fantastic new toy. The joy of exploration and discovery. I distinctly remember typing 'Grateful Dead' in the search box and my excitement growing as the results scrolled back like a revelation. I think it was 'Deadshow' I clicked on first and lost my breath when I saw the treasures displayed there. It was as though a warm and powerful light was shining on and within me. And to this day I still feel blessed that I found the Grateful Dead and they found me.
I still get affirmation of this feeling from the kindred souls that visit here, especially yours, Ashes. Thank you.

No I'm not aware of the story behind that verse. Other than the notes on Clearlight about the Martin Luther King verse and the account of the Further '99 show (wonder if there's a recording of that show somewhere), I don't know much about the song, except that the words are brimming with emotion. Haven't even heard the song, I'm sorry to say.

I hope you'll indulge me a little more because I just want to throw in a mention of Leaving Terrapin. This is another song which I've never heard except in my imagination. I find the words very moving (including the original version) and have always wondered why it was never played. I imagine this was one time the music faltered and Jerry's muse refrained from shining some light.
Alan

'Although the stars have shifted,
we're not lost
The wind alone itself
decides our course
Seems such a long time
since we saw any land
but a seabird brought
this olive branch
and dropped it in my hand'